At the anti-war forum in Paris, organized by the Russia-Libertés association, Evguenia Kara-Murza runs everywhere between the rooms of the Gaîté lyrique, where conferences of Russian opponents were held on September 30. “It’s a long marathon,” confides the human rights lawyer, in great demand, especially since her husband, Vladimir Kara-Murza, was imprisoned and sentenced to 25 years of detention for “high treason” of his opposition to the war in Ukraine. This is one of the highest prison sentences for a dissident, in the context of all-out repression in Russia since the start of the war in Ukraine. According to figures from the Russian NGO OVD-Info, nearly 20,000 Russians were sentenced to prison terms or fines for demonstrating against the war. This damning report is nevertheless a sign of hope for Evguenia Kara-Murza, because it shows that a (small) part of Russian society is mobilized. The opponent and member of the Free Russia organization nevertheless knows that “it will take a long time” to get out of Putinism. Interview.
L’Express: How is your husband, Vladimir Kara-Murza?
Evgenia Kara-Murza: Now he is confined in a disciplinary cell in a strict regime penal colony in the middle of Siberia, 3,000 kilometers from Moscow. The contact I have with Vladimir is sporadic, but it is still better than in Soviet times, when contact with political prisoners was non-existent. Today, they can receive letters, even if they are censored. And there are also, of course, the lawyers. They are real heroes. They work in the shadows in very hostile conditions and help to connect prisoners with their family members. They are also there to record all violations of the rights of political prisoners, so that we can have evidence and, perhaps one day, convict those responsible.
What are the different faces of the Russian opposition?
People who oppose the regime inside the country face absolutely enormous risks, as the regime uses all kinds of repressive methods against them, including punitive psychiatry, sexual assault or prison sentences of up to up to fifteen years for a simple “no” to war. So many of them are forced to resort to, let’s say, partisan and covert methods of protest. Then there are many civil groups, at the local level, who work and organize together. They show us that Russian civil society is still alive and continues to fight.
Finally, we must mention the groups of opponents or major figures abroad: Mikhail Kodorkhovsky, Garry Kasparov… These different opposition groups in exile have the mission of supporting those who remained inside, of creating connections that Vladimir Putin wants to destroy to make people believe that all the Russian people are a united, submissive mass who support him in his war in Ukraine. We are trying to give voice to those who work inside Russia, to find support for them. This solidarity is of capital importance.
Do Western countries have a role to play?
Western countries should also show solidarity with that part of Russian society which continues to oppose the regime of Vladimir Putin and condemns the war in Ukraine. This would send a strong message to Vladimir Putin, who by no means represents all of the Russian people. The international democratic community must recognize that many Russians would like to live in a democratic country based on respect for the rule of law and human rights.
Currently in Russia, the number of political prisoners is growing day by day, with at least 20,000 people arbitrarily arrested. There have been at least 8,000 administrative proceedings and 700 criminal proceedings opened against anti-war protesters. These are certainly not mass demonstrations, but in quasi-totalitarian countries, such actions rarely take place.
In Russia it’s the same thing. Vladimir Putin is doing everything to isolate the Russian population from the whole world, and very often Western countries unconsciously help him by closing borders and blocking visas to those who try to flee the country. These people are then forced to return to Russia, then they are mobilized to fight in Ukraine, where they die or are thrown into prison. More than 200,000 online media outlets have been blocked, and all independent media outlets easily accessible to the Russian population have been shut down. In such a context, it is easy for Vladimir Putin to create this idea that everyone supports him. But that’s not reality.
What means of action does the Russian opposition have?
Ukraine’s victory in the war is absolutely essential. In Russia, this kind of defeat, as was the case with the Russo-Japanese War at the beginning of the 20th century or the Afghan War in the 1980s, weakens the regime. First of all, defeat will show Vladimir Putin, as well as all other dictators, that such crimes are no longer allowed, and that they will have to answer for them before an international court of justice. This is why we should not only hope for a victory for Ukraine, but a victory for Ukraine under its conditions, with the restoration of its borders established in 1991 and internationally recognized. A people who are victims of brutal aggression cannot be forced to cede part of their territories to the aggressor to appease them. This will show Vladimir Putin that the period of impunity he experienced for more than two decades is over.
There are many Russians who support Ukraine. My organization (Free Russia Foundation), for example, is engaged in tracking down Ukrainian prisoners of war and civilian hostages in the Russian prison system to facilitate their release. There are, too, solitary protests that human rights organizations say are taking place every day across the country, although they may seem small. Finally, there are Russian soldiers dying every day, in large numbers. Families lose their children. They are the ones we must influence. It is these combined pressures from within and without that will weaken the regime. Only a massive approach can be effective. This is what we are trying to prepare.
Are the Russians ready to see the reality of this war?
It’s going to be a very long and very difficult process, as it was for German society after the Second World War, where it took several generations for people to realize what happened. First, it will be necessary to eliminate propaganda in Russia, unfortunately very effective, with new technologies. And first of all, we will have to unplug the propagandist TV. This education of the population and international justice can only be possible after the collapse of the regime.