It’s a book of around a hundred pages, very simple, with a concept that is nevertheless miraculous. In History of the other (published by Liana Levi), the even pages present the Israeli vision of History, the odd pages the Palestinian vision. Two peoples, two stories, two misunderstandings. Written twenty years ago by six Palestinian professors and six Israeli professors, a new edition of the book is coming out in French at the start of the year, while the war is brewing in Gaza and Israel remains traumatized by the massacres of October 7.
Who other than the historian Elie Barnavi to sign the afterword of this pocket utopia, this ode to respect and intelligence? The former diplomat, defender of peace and a two-state solution, has always fiercely opposed the cynicism of Benjamin Netanyahu. For The Express, he analyzes the historical responsibility of the Israeli Prime Minister in the fiasco of October 7 and the impasse of the war in Gaza.
L’Express: Since October 7, sacred union has taken place behind the flag in Israel. With one exception: the massive demonstrations against Benjamin Netanyahu. Is he the great divider of the nation?
Elie Barnavi: It’s a role he’s had for a long time. Its strategy has always been to divide and pit communities or political camps against each other. Today, the change is that there is almost unanimous opposition to him: only 15 to 20% of Israelis want him to remain in power, all the others want his political death.
Netanyahu built a loyal following during his long career and transformed his Likud party into a sect devoted to him, like Donald Trump in the United States. [avec le parti Républicain]. This device has been cracked since October 7 and there is not much left of it. The magician Netanyahu has lost his charm and few in Israel think he can survive.
His supporters also attribute responsibility for the October 7 fiasco to him?
The others were already convinced of this before. But even in his camp, he has lost his aura, and he finds himself with many adversaries within Likud. The latter still do not dare to say anything because of the sacred union that you evoke, but also because of the fear that Netanyahu continues to instill in his comrades. However, everyone smells blood and it will not survive politically at the end of the war.
In Tel Aviv, on February 18, 2023, tens of thousands of Israelis demonstrate against the reform of the judicial system initiated by the Netanyahu government.
© / Anadolu Agency via AFP
With these catastrophic polls, is there a risk that Netanyahu will seek to prolong the war, or even extend it to the regional level, in order to stay in power?
Objectively, Netanyahu’s interest lies in prolonging the war. But he is not all-powerful to wage this war. He had to bring two of his main political adversaries into the war cabinet, Benny Gantz and Gadi Eisenkot, so he is not alone in the maneuver. The army also has its say! Netanyahu alone cannot decide the length of the campaign or its intensity. Not to mention the Americans…
Far-right Israeli ministers and MPs speak of massive movements of Palestinians towards Egypt and the return of settlements to Gaza. What influence do they retain over Netanyahu?
Politically, they are decisive and prevent him from deciding anything. In Israel, the real debate about the day after has not begun. Our country finds itself engaged in a major military campaign without the slightest idea of how we will emerge from it. For fear of losing his majority, Netanyahu finds himself stuck between the United States and his far-right allies: the slightest concession made to the Americans could bring down his alliance.
Obviously, he does not share their ideas on Gaza and knows very well that they are inapplicable. He is not a fool, he knows how to read a map and understands the situation. But he finds himself politically paralyzed, and this is an additional reason to get rid of him: this Prime Minister is incapable of imagining a real political strategy for ending the war. And Americans are starting to lose patience. This situation cannot continue for several months…
A myth collapsed on October 7: that of our absolute freedom of maneuver. In Israel, the idea dominated that we were a military power that was both considerable and sovereign, that we alone decided our destiny, the intensity of our wars. Events do not unfold that way. Without American military aid, without their weapons, their ammunition, their shells, we cannot continue for long. The Americans have an enormous lever of influence, which they have not yet really used. They are the ones who determine the duration and intensity of Israeli military engagements.
In the afterword ofHistory of the other, you write that talking about peace after October 7 is not absurd, that solutions can emerge from these misfortunes. Are there any Israelis and Palestinians left to move towards peace despite the trauma, despite the war?
Despite this trauma, despite the war, even because of the trauma and the war, this catastrophe can serve as a historical pivot. An example: the two-state solution was completely demonetized, no one talked about it anymore. His only supporters, like me, only met pitying looks. Today, everyone is talking about it: the Americans, the Europeans, the Arabs… A key country like Saudi Arabia, which was on the verge of writing off the Palestinians, now assures that it will not There will be no normalization with Israel without a solution for the Palestinians.
As long as the war continues, it is difficult to imagine a settlement of the Palestinian question. But it is obvious that we are heading towards this path, that we will have to imagine what did not exist before, that is to say the reunification of the two pieces of Palestinian territory under the rule of the Palestinian Authority, with the involvement of the international community to ensure security in the Gaza Strip and its reconstruction. From all this misfortune, from all this blood, some good can come out.
A photo taken from Rafah showing a cloud of smoke rising on January 22, 2024 above Khan Younes in southern Gaza after fighting between the Israeli army and the Palestinian Islamist group Hamas
© / afp.com/-
Is this possible with the current leaders of both camps?
In Israel, nothing is possible with the current government, ideologically opposed to any progress. On the other hand, the Palestinian Authority is not really a presentable bride: it is a rotten, corrupt body, led by an old man without authority and discredited. [NDLR : Mahmoud Abbas]. But there are no others! To arrive at a serious formula, these two political obstacles will have to be blown. It will undoubtedly be faster with us than with them.
It will take time, but Israel cannot leave behind a kind of anarchic and poverty-stricken Somalia. [à Gaza]. Otherwise terrorism will rear its head and this war will have served no purpose.
Would Netanyahu’s departure be the first step towards eventual peace?
His departure and that of his entire team: the Prime Minister, as we have said, depends on extremist, supremacist elements, hostile to any political progress. We must see this government and Netanyahu as a whole. The major pre-war demonstrations to demand their resignation have already resumed, a commission of inquiry will be set up to determine responsibility for the catastrophe of October 7… Netanyahu will not be able to escape it.
After the Yom Kippur War in 1973, Likud seized power from Labor for the first time. Is such a political shift possible today?
Yes, but the situation is even more serious. The crisis opened by October 7 defies all comparison with that of the Yom Kippur War. At the time, it was a clash between two armies, without civilian losses, with a military victory at stake. Sharp and clear. Certainly, the failure of intelligence had produced trauma, but in no way comparable to this terrible collapse that we experienced on October 7. We must understand: this incredible, unprecedented pogrom occurred on the sovereign territory of Israel. Where was the army? Where was the State? Where were the special services?
Similarities still exist. First, after such a failure, leaders do not stay in power. It had taken a while, but Golda Meir [NDLR : la Première ministre de 1969 à 1974] had to leave. Three years later, the overthrow of May 1977 occurred and Likud won. These kinds of events always cause political, social and cultural earthquakes. October 7 will be no exception.
How will the history books remember Netanyahu?
His legacy will be truly catastrophic. He wanted to remain in History as Mr. Security, which resulted in October 7th. He wanted to be Mr. Economy, we will have to see the state of Israeli finances after this war. He wanted to be the man of peace with the Arab world, while sitting on the Palestinians, we see the result.
I am one of those who have never been impressed by Netanyahu’s legacy, even if I recognized in him great political skill, a lot of intelligence and a vast culture. But of its political, military and economic heritage, all that will remain is a field of ruins. Not even to mention his legal setbacks, which could see him end his career in prison. The whole thing turns out to be catastrophic, for him as for us.
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